Pacific Northwest Four Wheel Drive Association

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-   -   white river meeting (http://www.pnw4wda.org/forums/showthread.php?t=1676)

jim putman 04-08-2010 12:52 PM

white river meeting
 
White River Recreation Users
* Next Meeting on Tuesday April13, 2010
7:00 9:00 p.m.
at the department of Natural Resources Conference Building, at the corner of Highway 410 and Farmen Road, in Enumclaw.

Agenda Topics:
Recreation Update
- District Ranger and Snoqualmie Public Service Manager
- 09/10 Snoparks and Winter Recreation
- 2010 Projects
- Evans Creek Seasonal Closures
- Enumclaw Welcome Center Status
Other Topics

For further information, contact Bob Pacific at (360) 802-5310 or Mary Coughlin at (360) 802-5310

jim putman 04-13-2010 05:08 PM

This is tonight :luke:

jim putman 04-13-2010 10:28 PM

Yikes that was fun :BANGHEAD2: Thanks to all of you that showed up. I will try and type out a reoprt once my blood vessels retract a little.

reson46 04-14-2010 09:17 AM

Jim,

Do you have the names and positions of the USFS representatives that were at the meeting? I'm horrible with names and wasn't clear what everybody's role with the USFS is.

These are who I noted - I think I got one name correct. :rolleyes:

Jim Franzel (gray haired gentleman?) - District director?
New transfer from San Bernardino (I don't remember her name) - What is her role with the USFS?
Lady sitting to Jim's left (I think her name may have been Mary?) - What is her role with the USFS?
Gentleman sitting to her left - His name and role?
Officer on the end - Law enforcement officer for this part of the district.

I think for future meetings we may want to de-emphasize the fact that closing Evan's Creek will result in illegal activity elsewhere. We know this will happen and we know that the percentage of ORV users who participate in these activities are no greater than those in other recreation groups (hikers, bikers, etc.) who participate in similar illegal activities, but it was pretty obvious that the point was lost on Mary (?). It was apparent that her opinion of ORV activity was not favorable and that she would rather use those facts to shut down all motorized activity on public lands instead of leaving Evan's Creek open.

Thanks,
Willy

jim putman 04-14-2010 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reson46 (Post 12850)
Jim,

Do you have the names and positions of the USFS representatives that were at the meeting? I'm horrible with names and wasn't clear what everybody's role with the USFS is.

These are who I noted - I think I got one name correct. :rolleyes:

Jim Franzel (gray haired gentleman?) - District director?
New transfer from San Bernardino (I don't remember her name) - What is her role with the USFS?
Lady sitting to Jim's left (I think her name may have been Mary?) - What is her role with the USFS?
Gentleman sitting to her left - His name and role?
Officer on the end - Law enforcement officer for this part of the district.

I think for future meetings we may want to de-emphasize the fact that closing Evan's Creek will result in illegal activity elsewhere. We know this will happen and we know that the percentage of ORV users who participate in these activities are no greater than those in other recreation groups (hikers, bikers, etc.) who participate in similar illegal activities, but it was pretty obvious that the point was lost on Mary (?). It was apparent that her opinion of ORV activity was not favorable and that she would rather use those facts to shut down all motorized activity on public lands instead of leaving Evan's Creek open.

Thanks,
Willy



Willy, Thanks for coming last night. As heated as the meeting got I think it got through to them that this is a important issue and we will be seeing more attention on it. Bob and Mary have always been great to work with and have always been supportive of our sport and use. I think a lot of Marys frusration is due to the lack of knowledge of what the "non involved" wheelers are doing and saying. All they really hear is what our group has to say and sometimes thats just not enough. They need to understand that there is a cause and effect issue that they basicly ignore as a whole. The simple line that "there are other places to motorize" reflects how little they really understand what were up against. Again I think it went well and am optimistic that good things will follw. as for who was there.
Jim Franzel. District ranger (hes the boss)
Cecilia Reed Public service manager. basicly second or so in command for recreation (bob and marys boss.)
Mary Coughlin. recreation for white river district
Bob Pacific Recreation and manager for white river district.
Ian Cannon is the FS LEO for the district.

Nichol 04-14-2010 10:22 AM

don't get too excited. I gave the flyer to my husband who deals with these issues all too frequently due to Environmental Impact Statements and studies. He says this is a "done deal", we had our chance to make our voice heard during the "Comment" period.

I think we need to hold the FS accountable for the winter closure- this seems to be acceptable, it's the "other" extra closures that will hurt us- the closures during the summer months will be hard to swallow. At this point they seemed open to hearing more comment, however I'm not sure if this was a gesture to calm us down. I think the ink has dried on the paperwork, as they stated and it is done.

I hope this is not the case.

reson46 04-14-2010 11:11 AM

Jim, thanks for the information.

Did anybody make note of the other roads Ian mentioned that were open to motorized recreation? Where and what are these? I'm guessing just forest service roads?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nichol (Post 12853)
don't get too excited. I gave the flyer to my husband who deals with these issues all too frequently due to Environmental Impact Statements and studies. He says this is a "done deal", we had our chance to make our voice heard during the "Comment" period.

I think we need to hold the FS accountable for the winter closure- this seems to be acceptable, it's the "other" extra closures that will hurt us- the closures during the summer months will be hard to swallow. At this point they seemed open to hearing more comment, however I'm not sure if this was a gesture to calm us down. I think the ink has dried on the paperwork, as they stated and it is done.

I hope this is not the case.

Unfortunately this is the impression that I came away with too. It felt like it didn't matter that we were making legitimate points and had valid concerns, their decision had been made years ago and now they are going to force us to deal with it.

Willy

Dianamal77 04-15-2010 05:12 PM

Yes Willy, the other roads Ian mentioned are all forest service roads.

I walked away from the meeting a little frustrated. I too agree this is a done deal.

There will be cause and effect, no question about it. My worry is that once the seasonal closures are enforced, users will go to the few other areas we have left. The increased usage in those areas will have a significant impact and then those areas will too be shut down. Ultimately, maybe that's the goal of the FS?

jim putman 04-15-2010 05:48 PM

Wow what a defeatest type attitude I am sensing here:icon_sad: I wonder what would have happened to the little rattlesnake trail if I had just said "oh well you made a decission" Or the Copper city trail when they locked us out of there. Or maybe when most of Bald mountain changed hands into private ownership Is this worth fighting for or does everyone think its not ? Please let me know I cant just go into this fight alone and I wont waste my time if the backing and support isnt going to be there.

Nichol 04-15-2010 09:24 PM

Sorry Jim, but when it comes to the Supreme Court and an Endangered Species Act, I don't know what we can do. We missed the comment period. I have the highest hopes you can turn this around. Evan's is my backyard.


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